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[Darrian Wolffe]

Oh, Travis?  About the ASF thing?  I'm OK with you choosing the second pair of fighters, since we're choosing the Daggers.  That's reasonably in-line with the restrictions on the Mech selections (ASFs being closer to Mechs than vehicles when it comes to availability and production ease).

[Death or Glory]

Then let's look for a BA transport VTOL with a C3 slave.  I'm not actually sure there is such a thing, but that's pretty clearly what we need.

Make one platoon-level network very similar to what I posted above (JES, Manteuffel, Fulcrum) and one platoon-level network based around faster units and BA transport (VTOL, VTOL, fast Master Unit, fast long-range support unit).  That way the VTOLs can double as spotters for that particular lance after they've dropped off their cargo.

We won't have company-level networks, but individual lance-level networks are still legit.

What that ALSO means is that we have no room for artillery platforms.

Rob, before I start digging through record sheets, how strongly do you prefer using VTOLs instead of Hovercraft for BA transport?

[Black Omega]

Then let's look for a BA transport VTOL with a C3 slave.  I'm not actually sure there is such a thing, but that's pretty clearly what we need.

Make one platoon-level network very similar to what I posted above (JES, Manteuffel, Fulcrum) and one platoon-level network based around faster units and BA transport (VTOL, VTOL, fast Master Unit, fast long-range support unit).  That way the VTOLs can double as spotters for that particular lance after they've dropped off their cargo.

We won't have company-level networks, but individual lance-level networks are still legit.

What that ALSO means is that we have no room for artillery platforms.

Rob, before I start digging through record sheets, how strongly do you prefer using VTOLs instead of Hovercraft for BA transport?

I searched through HMV.  The only hover with a C3 slave is the new Pegasus but is has no cargo capacity.  There is a maxim variant for infantry w/6 ton cap.  The other maxims have 3 ton cap.  The most cargo vtol's are clan Anhur and IS Karnov w/7.  The IS Cavalry has 3t.  There is a Ferret that carries 2.5t    I've seen a lot of those back in the day.

[Riegien]

Oh, Travis?  About the ASF thing?  I'm OK with you choosing the second pair of fighters, since we're choosing the Daggers.  That's reasonably in-line with the restrictions on the Mech selections (ASFs being closer to Mechs than vehicles when it comes to availability and production ease).

I don't understand your reasoning here, but OK.

2 Stuka K10s

Since not everyone has it yet, there are also a couple of C3 slave hovers in 3145 FS, one of which is an omni so it can cart around mechanized BA.

[agustaaquila]

I'm not ok ( ), but for the ASF i think 2 ground attack birds.  The daggers should be fine in air superiority, so something with a little more punch.  I am against bomb trucks because we could be sent on long raids where our ability to resupply bombs could be limited.

I tend to think of our vees are more specialist where our mechs are more general.  So I like a c3 net, and am undecided on the other units.  MBT seem like too general, I would like to use mechs to hunt mechs because they are more survivable. 

[Darrian Wolffe]

I'm not ok ( ), but for the ASF i think 2 ground attack birds.  The daggers should be fine in air superiority, so something with a little more punch.  I am against bomb trucks because we could be sent on long raids where our ability to resupply bombs could be limited.

Those don't exist in this BV bracket.  Seriously.  Your viable ground attack fighters (able to throw around 8-point weapon hits or heavier AND at least 25 heat-neutral damage on a Strike are the normal minimums for a ground attack craft) while having a decent armor-by-mass-fraction (15-20%) are pretty much limited to the Royal Lightning, the Stuka, the F-92 Stingray, and some models of Huscarl and Corsair. 


Stukas have the advantage of at least having a crapton of armor and being able to haul around a 10-ton bomb load.  Plus it's got quad Large Lasers and, because it's the W10 model, enough heat sinks to use all 4 of them without going all "random movement".

That said, they require neutral skies or better to use, given that Transits will eat them for lunch (6/9 with AC/20s), or Transgressors for that matter (6/9 with triple ERLLs and heat neutral).  Which is what escorting Daggers are for.  We can do a LOT worse than those - everything else available has their own issues (usually low armor) or isn't an actual improvement (the Royal Lighting can only haul around the same 10 tons of bombs as the Stuka).


Side note: The W7 Chippewa has LUDICROUS amounts of firepower and the heatsinks to use most of it (plus it's supposed to get extra cooling from quirks - the lasers in the wings of Chippewas are one of the founding examples of the Insulated Weapon quirk).  The issue is that it has something like 8 tons of armor in total, on a 90-ton frame.  It is a deathtrap, full stop.  But it also hits INCREDIBLY hard in the attack role.  Quad LPLs and Quad MLs are going to leave a mark during a Strike or Strafe.  Are we willing to take the risk of losses here?

[agustaaquila]

Well, as CO sometimes I have to talk about things like acceptable losses.  So I'm ok with the risk of loss, because at some point we will need to withdraw for a few months to rearm and resupply.

[Darrian Wolffe]

Whelp, then.  The arguments have been made for and against pretty much everything in the bracket that matters.

Your call, sir.

[Death or Glory]

Rob, what're your thoughts regarding our battle armor options?

[Darrian Wolffe]

Rob, what're your thoughts regarding our battle armor options?

Pretty rough, actually.

The FedSuns doesn't have a lot of access to the really good "close-in" battle armor (the Grenadier hits very, very hard...and is slow and not especially well-protected), and we're not playing C3i/TAG/SGLRM games.  With that in mind, I think that we ought to be relatively heavy on the Hauberks (a stealthed, mobile, LRM-20 turret) for support and Cavaliers for general use.

With 32 tons of transport capacity available (each suit counting as 1 ton), I'd look at two platoons, each integrated to work among themselves:

1 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Hauberk (LRM5)
2 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Hauberk (LRM5)
3 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Hauberk (LRM5)
4 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Grenadier (HunterKiller)

1 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Cavalier (MG)
2 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Cavalier (Flamer)
3 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Cavalier (SRM - Infernos)
4 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Infiltrator Mk II (magnetic or Puma)

1st Squad works as a support unit, essentially creating 2 mobile LRM20s, and the Grenadiers act as a close-range "bodyguard" force to screen them and make anybody who comes after them really, really regret it (that's an SRM20 right there).

2nd Squad ends up being a more "traditional" BA force, more centered around anti-infantry and anti-BA duty and functions as a general-purpose unit.  The Infiltrators either ease our logistics burden by mounting MagClamps, which allow them to hitch a ride on any Mech (or tank, maybe...I'm not sure), or allow us to do more "spec-ops" style stuff if we use the parafoil-equipped Puma model.

Finally, I would murder a First Prince to get our hands on a platoon of Kopis Battle Armor.


EDIT: Oh, the BA in the 3145 book are complete crap.  The Fusilier has promise with the Plasma Rifle version...but then goes and mounts Reflective Armor, which is worse than useless against bombs and artillery (ie, the ways to get rid of BA).

EDIT2: Wow, I stuffed that up. Fixed.

[Death or Glory]

Pretty rough, actually.

The FedSuns doesn't have a lot of access to the really good "close-in" battle armor (the Grenadier hits very, very hard...and is slow and not especially well-protected), and we're not playing C3i/TAG/SGLRM games.  With that in mind, I think that we ought to be relatively heavy on the Hauberks (a stealthed, mobile, LRM-20 turret) for support and Cavaliers for general use.

With 32 tons of transport capacity available (each suit counting as 1 ton), I'd look at two platoons, each integrated to work among themselves:

1 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Hauberk (LRM5)
2 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Hauberk (LRM5)
3 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Hauberk (LRM5)
4 Squad, 1 Platoon: x4 Grenadier (HunterKiller)

1 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Cavalier (MG)
2 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Cavalier (Flamer)
3 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Cavalier (SRM - Infernos)
4 Squad, 2 Platoon: x4 Infiltrator Mk II (magnetic or Puma)

1st Squad works as a support unit, essentially creating 2 mobile LRM20s, and the Grenadiers act as a close-range "bodyguard" force to screen them and make anybody who comes after them really, really regret it (that's an SRM20 right there).

2nd Squad ends up being a more "traditional" BA force, more centered around anti-infantry and anti-BA duty and functions as a general-purpose unit.  The Infiltrators either ease our logistics burden by mounting MagClamps, which allow them to hitch a ride on any Mech (or tank, maybe...I'm not sure), or allow us to do more "spec-ops" style stuff if we use the parafoil-equipped Puma model.

Finally, I would murder a First Prince to get our hands on a platoon of Kopis Battle Armor.


EDIT: Oh, the BA in the 3145 book are complete crap.  The Fusilier has promise with the Plasma Rifle version...but then goes and mounts Reflective Armor, which is worse than useless against bombs and artillery (ie, the ways to get rid of BA).

EDIT2: Wow, I stuffed that up. Fixed.

Travis's post at the start of this thread mentioned that we would have between 4 and 16 squads of battle armor, which leads me to believe that for unit selection purposes we're using a suit's actual weight instead of its one ton approximated transport weight.  We should probably get this clarified before we get too involved in a battle armor discussion.  In the meantime, I'm going to review our potential transport options.

[Darrian Wolffe]

Travis's post at the start of this thread mentioned that we would have between 4 and 16 squads of battle armor, which leads me to believe that for unit selection purposes we're using a suit's actual weight instead of its one ton approximated transport weight.  We should probably get this clarified before we get too involved in a battle armor discussion.  In the meantime, I'm going to review our potential transport options.

I was going by the fact that as per TW, all battle armor takes up 1 ton of cargo space, and our DropShip explicitly has 32 tons available for Battle Armor stowage.

But yes, a clarification that part would be helpful.

[Riegien]

Ah, ok.  I probably should have read techmanual a bit better while rebuilding your Triumph.  You have 32 BA Bays.  Each one holds 1 trooper.  Everything else is listed in tons, so I assumed that 1 = 1 ton of suit not 1 trooper when I wrote up your TO&E.  I also thought that light BA were 500kg not 750kg, leading to the 16 squad possible, which is a mistake.

Finally, I would murder a First Prince to get our hands on a platoon of Kopis Battle Armor.

Noted.

[Darrian Wolffe]

Ah, ok.  I probably should have read techmanual a bit better while rebuilding your Triumph.  You have 32 BA Bays.  Each one holds 1 trooper.  Everything else is listed in tons, so I assumed that 1 = 1 ton of suit not 1 trooper when I wrote up your TO&E.  I also thought that light BA were 500kg not 750kg, leading to the 16 squad possible, which is a mistake.

OK, so we can essentially take 8, 4-man squads of *whatever* Battle Armor?

[Riegien]

Yep, go nuts.

I was going by the fact that as per TW, all battle armor takes up 1 ton of cargo space

Do you have the page reference for this?  I'm still searching for it.
Nevermind, found it.