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[Riegien]

The Avatar-OC has a master.  Since we have an Avatar already, do we get all the Omni configs too?

All but the R.  It just costs a few points to reconfigure the omni

and the AIV Urbie (yes, it's available to us...).   

I think we already selected our artillery with Schriltrons but Come On GM, its too hilarious to not let us have a few.

You're welcome to take them, but you've got a 4 tube limit for the battalion so you'll need to drop a Schiltron.  Or have them and some mechs die horribly and switch your arty choices to them.

[Darrian Wolffe]

You're welcome to take them, but you've got a 4 tube limit for the battalion so you'll need to drop a Schiltron.  Or have them and some mechs die horribly and switch your arty choices to them.

Ah - HA!  We don't HAVE any tube artillery!  We only have missile/rocket artillery! 

http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/general-discussion-area-on-equipment/rocket-vs-tube-artillery/


There's only a campaign limitation on TUBES!  We can have all the AIVs we want!  MUA-HA-HA-HA-HA!

[Riegien]

You're welcome to take them, but you've got a 4 tube limit for the battalion so you'll need to drop a Schiltron.  Or have them and some mechs die horribly and switch your arty choices to them.

Ah - HA!  We don't HAVE any tube artillery!  We only have missile/rocket artillery! 

http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/general-discussion-area-on-equipment/rocket-vs-tube-artillery/


There's only a campaign limitation on TUBES!  We can have all the AIVs we want!  MUA-HA-HA-HA-HA!

Oops, you caught me.  Go for it.

On a completely unrelated matter, for the first game I'll need some AT scale Unions. 

[serrate]

So with the Avatar are we good for C3 masters? I'll pick up the Cyclops if needed, but I'd rather not. Hmmm, actually maybe I'll just bring another Avatar anyway.

[Darrian Wolffe]

So with the Avatar are we good for C3 masters? I'll pick up the Cyclops if needed, but I'd rather not. Hmmm, actually maybe I'll just bring another Avatar anyway.

With the Avatar option, we should be OK.  The goal is to - in general - not give the enemy an OBVIOUS C3 Master target at which to shoot.

Which the Fennec by itself is.  Granted, it hangs back at 15+ hexes and shoots with x2 PPCs while running.  But still.

[Black Omega]

On a completely unrelated matter, for the first game I'll need some AT scale Unions. 

Do you mean Unions that are the size of mech scale aerospace fighters or just big enough to be an emergency load in a 12 gauge shotgun and that are based and can be used on atmosphere hexes or space maps with warships?    If so, I have 2. 

[serrate]

Javelin JVN-11D
Enforcer III ENF-6NAIS
Axman AMX-3SR
Stealth - not really sure which model to choose on this one. I suppose the 2D1 is fine if we want yet another c3 slave.

[Darrian Wolffe]

Hokay...so far I've gone through TROs 3058, 3060, 3067r; 3075; 3085 and Prototypes; and also used Xotl's Quirks List (which is semi-official since he's on the MUL Team and generally covers TROs 3039 and 3050) as a basis.

Here's a quirks list which ought to cover basically everything we've got.  If a Mech doesn't appear on it, then the writeup and/or artwork isn't sufficient to justify a given Mech quirk according to the above sources.  A whole LOT of writeups in the TROs are actually really sparse, so there's fairly few Mechs which qualify for published quirks (I've got about 240 entries of out of about 750 Mech chassis).

A few notes:
1) This is only about Mechs.  No Vees, no ASFs (the Chippewas should, IMO, be the exception here, since they're actually the source of the Improved Cooling Jacket quirk), and no IndustrialMechs.

2) Some Quirks are abbreviated.  Narrow Profile instead of Narrow/Low Profile.  No Arms instead of No/Minimal Arms, and so forth.

3) Quirks are assigned to chassis.  If a particular variant should have a quirk, it is a limitation written in the Quirk section itself; assume all quirks apply to ALL models of a unit unless the quirk is physically impossible to apply (such as the Improved Cooling Jacket for the ERLL on the Barghest...there's a model that doesn't have any ER Larges at all).

4) "No Arms" and "No Torso Twist" quirks are judgement calls based on the artwork... 

-4a) My guideline for "No Torso Twist" is that the Mech have no visible "turret ring" at the waist, and look to have limited enough mobility in the hip and knee joints so as not to be able to shift the direction of the torso by bending one leg and rotating around the bent leg's hip.  The Cestus and Bushwacker are good examples here.

-4b) My guideline for "No Arms" is to look at the Mech and ask myself if I think the arms pictured on the Mech could help it stand; just having "gun arms" is not a qualifier...I give Mechs with long weapon barrels such as the Rifleman, Razorback, or the Talon the benefit of the doubt.  Having two arms with tiny weapons on them (Strider) or one arm with a long weapon but that appears to be fixed in place (UrbanMech) are generally what qualifies a Mech for this quirk.

5) I'm happy to defend or explain any choices.  If Xotl was the one who assigned the quirks, then I'll reference him as the answer.  Otherwise I can quote a passage or show the art to explain why a Mech has a given Quirk.

[Darrian Wolffe]

Javelin JVN-11D
Enforcer III ENF-6NAIS
Axman AMX-3SR
Stealth - not really sure which model to choose on this one. I suppose the 2D1 is fine if we want yet another c3 slave.

I think I'd personally prefer to see the Stealth 2D2.  Trades out the C3 for a TAG system - something we're fairly light on for as much as we enjoy artillery.  Given that your other three choices are all C3-compatible, I think we've actually got enough stuff to set up a network already.

So, assuming a -2D2 Stealth, and assuming my Quirks list is OK, we're looking like this for our mech forces (see downloadable *.xls below):

[Riegien]

Chippewa gets cooling jackets as appropriate.  Could you explain the narrow/low profile on the Marauder?

[Death or Glory]

Since we're hurting for C3 Masters, I'd like to have our Avatar start out in the C configuration instead of the G configuration.

[serrate]

Well it looks like we'd have 2 C3 lances, BUT we only have one 'dedicated' Master. Travis doesn't want us mixing and matching units within lances for missions, which I totally agree with, so that means in order to build a second C3 lance, we'd have to lock that Avatar into a C3 lance... and if we wanted to use a different loadout on the Avatar we've nullified the entire lance's potential network.

Since these are going to be set lances, it seems like we would be better off with another Master. I'm the last one to the table here, so I'll switch out one of my C3 units for a master. I like the look of the Fennec, and could get one at GenCon. What other choices are there? The Cyclops has a version with 2 Masters, which would allow us to link all 8 C3 units into a single network, right? So I guess that's appealing, even though... Bleh...Cyclops.

What other choices do I have for C3 Masters?

Also, would you rather see me replace the Javelin or the Enforcer III with the new master unit (the Axman is non-negotiable at this time )?

*Heh, while I was typing this, I see John was considering the same issue.

[Darrian Wolffe]

Chippewa gets cooling jackets as appropriate.  Could you explain the narrow/low profile on the Marauder?

http://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=1219.0

Download Xotl's PDF.  The one he says is 75 pages.

I can understand his rationale, but it's a judgement call.  An unseen Marauder from the front REALLY presents a small target.  That said, I'd probably remove it for post-TRO:PP Marauders, given how much they flatten out.  There's a couple other Quirks that are separated like that, so there's precedent.

[Death or Glory]

Okay, while going through our mech list, I noticed a couple problems.

First off, the Tarantula ZPH-3A and Bushwacker BSW-S2 aren't on the Federated Suns, Filtvelt Coalition, or Inner Sphere General faction lists for the Republic Era.  The Tarantula ZPH-3A is on the Inner Sphere General list for the Jihad Era and the Bushwacker BSW-S2 is on the Federated Suns list for the Jihad Era, so it looks like Mike was filtering by the wrong era while selecting units.  If you guys like the Bushwacker, then the BSW-S2r is available, which is basically a BSW-S2 that drops one SRM-4 and the ER Large Laser in order to mount a Plasma Rifle.

Secondly, I can not verify that the Firestarter FS9-M3 is actually a canon unit.  Even its mentioning on sarna has a "citation needed" tag.  However, as Steve's post mentioned the FS9-S3 instead of the FS9-M3 this appears to be a typo on Rob's part.

[Death or Glory]

What other choices do I have for C3 Masters?

Honestly, nothing is really springing to mind.  For whatever reason, the Federated Suns loved putting a C3 slave in damn near everything during the Civil War and Jihad, but never really got around to designing a unit with a C3 master until the Fennec.  Unless I'm forgetting a unit, our C3 master options are pretty much limited to the Avatar, Cyclops, and Fennec.